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PostPosted: Tue May 16th, 2017, 02:15 GMT 

Joined: Sun May 18th, 2008, 18:26 GMT
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how about spring 1995 and fall 2000 and ....

autumn of 2001 and 2002....even summer 2007 wasn't that bad....


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PostPosted: Tue May 16th, 2017, 02:31 GMT 
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Location: In a hole in the ground there lived a....
No.


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PostPosted: Tue May 16th, 2017, 05:27 GMT 

Joined: Sat October 23rd, 2010, 16:06 GMT
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To answer this thread's question: No.


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PostPosted: Tue May 16th, 2017, 07:07 GMT 

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No.


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PostPosted: Tue May 16th, 2017, 07:16 GMT 
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Not. Even. Close.


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PostPosted: Tue May 16th, 2017, 20:44 GMT 
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I think his last "great" year was maybe 2001. He gave us a solid album and was still performing well (much of the time). I don't think it totally dropped off after that year but the iceberg was off in the distance, IMO.


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PostPosted: Tue May 16th, 2017, 21:07 GMT 

Joined: Tue June 21st, 2016, 17:01 GMT
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Yes.

The last good year was 2000. The last good tour? I don't know. I gave up following closely in 2005, and just check in once in a while to see if his most recent "greatest concert ever" is any good. They have their moments.


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PostPosted: Thu May 18th, 2017, 05:24 GMT 
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I would say 1981 was his last great year as a live performer. I find it hard to listen to any live show after 1981. (The only time I saw Dylan live was in 1997.)

1982-83 is probably his last great period in the studio (even though he botched the album which resulted), with the possible exception of the early 1989 sessions in New Orleans with Lanois. However, I've come to think recently that Oh Mercy would likely have either not existed or been another sticky turd without Lanois's direction. So I'm not sure Dylan gets all the credit for it (and it was another botched sessions-to-album anyway).

I just can't enjoy any Dylan after 1989.


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PostPosted: Thu May 18th, 2017, 08:13 GMT 
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I don't know if I can pin it down to a particular year but I thought the shows I saw in 2000 and 2002 were something special. Love and Theft came out around 2002 as well so I put that era as Dylan's last great period.


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PostPosted: Thu May 18th, 2017, 09:03 GMT 

Joined: Wed February 16th, 2005, 21:50 GMT
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panther wrote:
I would say 1981 was his last great year as a live performer. I find it hard to listen to any live show after 1981. (The only time I saw Dylan live was in 1997.)

1982-83 is probably his last great period in the studio (even though he botched the album which resulted), with the possible exception of the early 1989 sessions in New Orleans with Lanois. However, I've come to think recently that Oh Mercy would likely have either not existed or been another sticky turd without Lanois's direction. So I'm not sure Dylan gets all the credit for it (and it was another botched sessions-to-album anyway).

I just can't enjoy any Dylan after 1989.


"Limited in thoughts they dare..."


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PostPosted: Thu May 18th, 2017, 14:36 GMT 

Joined: Mon March 16th, 2009, 10:46 GMT
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No! He was in good voice (in retrospect, though this certainly was not the feeling
at the time) and the US leg of the tour was refreshing. Not much beyond that.


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PostPosted: Thu May 18th, 2017, 19:42 GMT 
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Location: In the valley of the giants where the stars and stripes explode
I would say, everything was more or less OK and enjoyable up to '04 with superb tours in the 90's, especially '99
After that it got worse every year, with occasional some rare good moments in shows from '05 '07 '08 '09
Fall 2013 was a welcome relief after the disgusting '10 '11 '12
Since then one boring show after the other.


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PostPosted: Thu May 18th, 2017, 19:50 GMT 
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panther wrote:
I would say 1981 was his last great year as a live performer. I find it hard to listen to any live show after 1981. (The only time I saw Dylan live was in 1997.)

1982-83 is probably his last great period in the studio (even though he botched the album which resulted), with the possible exception of the early 1989 sessions in New Orleans with Lanois. However, I've come to think recently that Oh Mercy would likely have either not existed or been another sticky turd without Lanois's direction. So I'm not sure Dylan gets all the credit for it (and it was another botched sessions-to-album anyway).

I just can't enjoy any Dylan after 1989.


I totally agree.
There was Infidels, which boasts Jokerman.
Some more decent live years (namely 1987).
It's all downhill, after that.
All the great releases post-Jokerman (Bootleg Series, to name one) are just pre-80's jewels.


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PostPosted: Thu May 18th, 2017, 19:57 GMT 

Joined: Sun April 16th, 2017, 20:08 GMT
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I'd say yes, but that is not to say there have not been classic shows since.


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PostPosted: Thu May 18th, 2017, 21:56 GMT 

Joined: Mon March 16th, 2009, 10:46 GMT
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Giuseppe Gazerro wrote:
panther wrote:
I would say 1981 was his last great year as a live performer. I find it hard to listen to any live show after 1981. (The only time I saw Dylan live was in 1997.)

1982-83 is probably his last great period in the studio (even though he botched the album which resulted), with the possible exception of the early 1989 sessions in New Orleans with Lanois. However, I've come to think recently that Oh Mercy would likely have either not existed or been another sticky turd without Lanois's direction. So I'm not sure Dylan gets all the credit for it (and it was another botched sessions-to-album anyway).

I just can't enjoy any Dylan after 1989.


I totally agree.
There was Infidels, which boasts Jokerman.
Some more decent live years (namely 1987).
It's all downhill, after that.
All the great releases post-Jokerman (Bootleg Series, to name one) are just pre-80's jewels.


That includes (in your opinion) Time Out Of Mind and Love & Theft?


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PostPosted: Thu May 18th, 2017, 22:15 GMT 
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gerardv wrote:
Giuseppe Gazerro wrote:

I totally agree.
There was Infidels, which boasts Jokerman.
Some more decent live years (namely 1987).
It's all downhill, after that.
All the great releases post-Jokerman (Bootleg Series, to name one) are just pre-80's jewels.


That includes (in your opinion) Time Out Of Mind and Love & Theft?


Absolutely it does.
Actually you just mentioned the 2 most iconic symbols of his decadence.

Because there's been worse, sure.
For instance, Together Through Life is surely worse, possibly the worst Dylan ever.

But Time Out Of Mind marks the beginning of the resigned, lost and hopeless Dylan; the first record in which he himself stated, signed and certified his end.
*It's not dark yet, but it's getting there.*
*It's alright ma? Those songs don't come to me anymore*

And Love And Theft is the first record in which Dylan ultimately gave up rock'n roll for good; surrendered to the extinguishing of his magic sparkle, accepted the fact that inspiration had closed its doors and transformed himself into a sad globetrotter crooner.

So, yes; especially (not included!) those 2 albums.

Oh, I forgot:
in my opinion.
:)


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PostPosted: Sat May 20th, 2017, 00:32 GMT 
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gerardv wrote:
That includes (in your opinion) Time Out Of Mind and Love & Theft?

Yes, I think I've written about it before, but I dislike Time Out of Mind. Love and Theft at least has some lighter touches, but I don't like it either. There's a lot of lazy writing on the former, and a lot of dull blues-cliches.

Regardless of the songs, I can't accept Dylan's voice after the 80s. It's simply unlistenable.

For me, Self Portrait is way better than Time Out of Mind.


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PostPosted: Sat May 20th, 2017, 02:57 GMT 
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panther wrote:
gerardv wrote:
For me, Self Portrait is way better than Time Out of Mind.


Wow. Love this site for statements like that! Difference is all !


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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PostPosted: Sat May 20th, 2017, 06:01 GMT 

Joined: Tue June 9th, 2015, 06:47 GMT
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Having seen him in previously in '78 and '80, the '81 shows stood out at the time as being a return to form, with truly memorable performances. Though I still have a fondness for that era, it doesn't come close to the consistency and quality of the performances he gave from 1999-2002. For me, that was his third creative peak--not reaching the heights of the mid-60's perhaps, but equal to if not better than the mid-70's. Luckily, via the magic of recording technology, we can enjoy it all.


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PostPosted: Sat May 20th, 2017, 13:44 GMT 
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panther wrote:
gerardv wrote:
That includes (in your opinion) Time Out Of Mind and Love & Theft?

Yes, I think I've written about it before, but I dislike Time Out of Mind. Love and Theft at least has some lighter touches, but I don't like it either. There's a lot of lazy writing on the former, and a lot of dull blues-cliches.

Regardless of the songs, I can't accept Dylan's voice after the 80s. It's simply unlistenable.

For me, Self Portrait is way better than Time Out of Mind.


Good gosh, how on earth can you rate a double album crammed full of dubious cover versions, second rate originals and the odd live track over an album of 11 great original songs. Songs like Love Sick, Cold Irons Bound, Tryin' To Get To Heaven, Make You Feel My Love and Not Dark Yet made me sit up and take notice more than anything from Self Portrait ever did.


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PostPosted: Sat May 20th, 2017, 18:45 GMT 

Joined: Sun April 16th, 2017, 20:08 GMT
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I remember there would be a feeling of great excitement leading up to a Dylan show, that pleasant kind of anxiety caused by not knowing what songs he would play, not knowing if his band would be the same, if one of the musicians had been replaced etc etc. And then the next day waiting for the reviews only to read something that seemed to be a review of a different event, it was once fashionable for journalists to slag off Dylan's live shows. I think the tide turned once Bob became a 33rd degree mason, that was when the reviews became glowing and the accolades started coming almost weekly.


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PostPosted: Sat May 20th, 2017, 20:28 GMT 

Joined: Fri January 5th, 2007, 23:38 GMT
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SDR wrote:
I remember there would be a feeling of great excitement leading up to a Dylan show, that pleasant kind of anxiety caused by not knowing what songs he would play, not knowing if his band would be the same, if one of the musicians had been replaced etc etc. And then the next day waiting for the reviews only to read something that seemed to be a review of a different event, it was once fashionable for journalists to slag off Dylan's live shows. I think the tide turned once Bob became a 33rd degree mason, that was when the reviews became glowing and the accolades started coming almost weekly.


?


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PostPosted: Sat May 20th, 2017, 20:56 GMT 

Joined: Sun April 16th, 2017, 20:08 GMT
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Mickvet wrote:
SDR wrote:
I remember there would be a feeling of great excitement leading up to a Dylan show, that pleasant kind of anxiety caused by not knowing what songs he would play, not knowing if his band would be the same, if one of the musicians had been replaced etc etc. And then the next day waiting for the reviews only to read something that seemed to be a review of a different event, it was once fashionable for journalists to slag off Dylan's live shows. I think the tide turned once Bob became a 33rd degree mason, that was when the reviews became glowing and the accolades started coming almost weekly.


?


I will admit to being a conspiracy theorist, I think the worlds needs more of them, contrary to be the mainstream media's view I would say the majority of us don't see a conspiracy in everything.

It is not so hard to believe Bob being a mason, the actor Richard Dreyfuss recently became a 33rd degree mason.


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PostPosted: Sat May 20th, 2017, 21:26 GMT 

Joined: Fri January 5th, 2007, 23:38 GMT
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Location: Ireland
SDR wrote:
Mickvet wrote:

?


I will admit to being a conspiracy theorist, I think the worlds needs more of them, contrary to be the mainstream media's view I would say the majority of us don't see a conspiracy in everything.

It is not so hard to believe Bob being a mason, the actor Richard Dreyfuss recently became a 33rd degree mason.


I would think Dylan's detailed knowledge and self-proclaimed belief in the Book of Revelation fairly ensures his immunity to that.

Disregarding conspiracy theory, I consider the return of Dylan to critical favour, not that one should pay much attention to critics, a consequence firstly of an increasing improvement in quality and consistency of live performance from about late 1992 onward and secondly the production of an indisputably fine studio album, TOOM in 1997, hailed as it was by many of his most respected musical contemporaries. His rehabilitation was probably assisted by the growing staleness of the washed-up rock star theme and the novelty of the concept of the resurrected musical veteran. Sheer hard work and continued quality has been the simple explanation for the continuation of this trend.

The position of 'Things Have Changed' as the continuous opener of his current concerts seems, thematically, to be the antithesis to the worldview of freemasonry, not to mention the entire philosophy represented by the songs of Tempest.

I say all of the above in the context that many in the media, insanely envious of the talents that they have the mere duty to report and describe, take great delight in reporting what they perceive as the collapse of a former great star to the mediocrity they themselves represented. To paraphrase the character Dylan so astutely described, something was happening and they didn't know (not by a long shot) what it was.


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PostPosted: Sat May 20th, 2017, 21:36 GMT 

Joined: Sun April 16th, 2017, 20:08 GMT
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I remember not liking TOOM when I first heard it, it took a couple of years to grow on me and it just gets better and better with each listen. The opposite happened with Love and Theft and even more so with Tempest, I thought Tempest was a masterpiece akin to Blonde on Blonde after the first hearing, on the second hearing I thought it was just a good album, on the third it became tiring. The production on Tempest is also terrible, everything has been mastered at the same high volume to the point there are no subtleties in the music and it sounds almost like white noise.

I still think Love and Theft is a really good album but not in the same league as TOOM.


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